Concord III : Pots, Trem and Whammy advice

View previous topic View next topic Go down

Concord III : Pots, Trem and Whammy advice

Post by fret_burn on Tue Sep 28, 2010 2:04 pm

Hi, i'm currently putting a Concord III back together that i received in bits and looking for some advice on a couple of things.

Firstly, the Trem block has a crack in it along the whammy bar shaft... see here:


Is there a way i can repair it? I think the crack is just above where the thread starts.

Also, i don't have the whammy bar, is there any particular one i should replace it with? i think i remember reading something about Japanese threads being slightly different.

Secondly, the volume and tone pots have all had the stems snapped off (looks as if they didn't know how to remove the knobs and resorted to brute force!) so i think i need to replace them. I've no idea whether there are any particular ones i need or where to get them in the UK ?

Here's a photo in case it helps!



Thanks alot!

fret_burn
Registered Member

Number of posts : 5
Registration date : 2010-09-28

Back to top Go down

Re: Concord III : Pots, Trem and Whammy advice

Post by Westbone on Tue Sep 28, 2010 3:17 pm

Hello, The bridge is a cast 1 piece item. You could take it to a local welder/brazer, tap it back, weld/braze and clean out the thread. Can't remember the thread at the mo. but pretty sure it's 6mm course. Plenty of trem arms about.
All the pots/controls are 250's.Tap guitar potentiometers into ebay, you'll find them.
Any problems( which there will be) Ask.
Cheers.

Westbone
Financial supporter

Number of posts : 4857
Location : Redbridge
Registration date : 2008-12-28

http://www.chruler.com/

Back to top Go down

Re: Concord III : Pots, Trem and Whammy advice

Post by fret_burn on Tue Sep 28, 2010 4:29 pm

Thanks Westbone, thats a great help!

fret_burn
Registered Member

Number of posts : 5
Registration date : 2010-09-28

Back to top Go down

Re: Concord III : Pots, Trem and Whammy advice

Post by Barry on Tue Sep 28, 2010 6:36 pm

Hi fret_burn.
Yup, Westbone's right, 6mm should fit just fine, and the pots are a pretty straight forward replacement too. The only real nuisance will be getting someone to do the brazing/welding repair on the sustain block.

Snapping off the shaft to retrieve the knobs, eh? That's a new one on me. Some of the things people do just makes my head hurt at times. Evil or Very Mad

_________________
"A little song. A little dance. A little seltzer down your pants." -Chuckles the Clown


GUITARS : http://legend.barryeames.com/guitars.html
MUSIC/PIX/VIDEOS: http://getback.barryeames.com (including Spectrum ST)

Barry
Hero, Legend, and all round good guy

Number of posts : 6119
Age : 71
Location : Port Weller, St. Catharines, Canada
Registration date : 2009-05-01

http://www.barryeames.com

Back to top Go down

Re: Concord III : Pots, Trem and Whammy advice

Post by corsair on Wed Sep 29, 2010 3:04 am

Bear in mind that the sustain block is made of pot metal and will require some pretty specialised welding skills, or at least it used to!! I know I tried to have one of my bridges welded and was told that it wasn't possible because of the quality of the metal in the casting...

_________________
FWIW, an after market esoteric nut is a solution to a problem that doesn't exist, and a great way to convert your money into someone else’s.

corsair
Administrator

Number of posts : 5248
Age : 57
Location : Hervey Bay, Australia.
Registration date : 2008-04-08

Back to top Go down

Re: Concord III : Pots, Trem and Whammy advice

Post by Guest on Wed Sep 29, 2010 5:09 pm

I don't think a 6mm arm will fit - the arm on my Concord III is 5mm, a 6mm arm won't even fit through the hole never mind screw in.

Guest
Guest


Back to top Go down

Re: Concord III : Pots, Trem and Whammy advice

Post by Racing on Wed Sep 29, 2010 5:16 pm

Sorry to be the one that pees on your parade,but John(Corsair) is right.
It simply isn´t cost effective to even try and repair that tremoloblock.
Pot metal as stated,and high on zink content making it not only hard but hazardous to braze it.

Word of advice is to get a replacement out of steel and then install your Westone saddles onto that.
Doing so make sure you get a replacement trem bridge with the same C/C spacing for the saddles.

An added benefit is that a fresh steel trem will improve tone vastly.


Racing
Hero, Legend, and all round good guy

Number of posts : 185
Age : 51
Registration date : 2009-02-27

Back to top Go down

Re: Concord III : Pots, Trem and Whammy advice

Post by grogg on Wed Sep 29, 2010 5:31 pm

Before binning the tremolo block you could try a really good hard two part adhesive like one of the araldites.

grogg
Senior Member

Number of posts : 1079
Location : Cardiff
Registration date : 2008-11-28

Back to top Go down

Re: Concord III : Pots, Trem and Whammy advice

Post by Steve777 on Wed Sep 29, 2010 6:43 pm

I would also advocate a replacement block, however, are these blocks directly interchangeable with strat blocks? If not, then its back to making one from scratch, not difficult, but personally, and I stress IMO, brass would be a better medium. Its easier to work with. If you like plenty of high end frequencies then steel is the way to go. Brass will bring out more of the mid range.

Still, it all comes down to cost vis a vis personal metal working skills. Have a go ... that what its all about!

Steve777
Senior Member

Number of posts : 356
Age : 59
Location : Coventry, UK
Registration date : 2008-10-14

Back to top Go down

Re: Concord III : Pots, Trem and Whammy advice

Post by Westbone on Wed Sep 29, 2010 8:08 pm

The trem. arm on a Concord III is indeed 6mm.
The block and bridge are cast as one so the block cannot be changed.



Uploaded with ImageShack.us

Westbone
Financial supporter

Number of posts : 4857
Location : Redbridge
Registration date : 2008-12-28

http://www.chruler.com/

Back to top Go down

Re: Concord III : Pots, Trem and Whammy advice

Post by Steve777 on Wed Sep 29, 2010 8:15 pm

Ahhhh... so it's cast as one errrrr .... as in picture 1 ! Apologies ... just off to Spec savers.

Steve777
Senior Member

Number of posts : 356
Age : 59
Location : Coventry, UK
Registration date : 2008-10-14

Back to top Go down

Re: Concord III : Pots, Trem and Whammy advice

Post by Westbone on Wed Sep 29, 2010 8:22 pm



Westbone
Financial supporter

Number of posts : 4857
Location : Redbridge
Registration date : 2008-12-28

http://www.chruler.com/

Back to top Go down

Re: Concord III : Pots, Trem and Whammy advice

Post by Barry on Wed Sep 29, 2010 8:36 pm

Gee that's purdy!
Just gorgeous Westbone.

_________________
"A little song. A little dance. A little seltzer down your pants." -Chuckles the Clown


GUITARS : http://legend.barryeames.com/guitars.html
MUSIC/PIX/VIDEOS: http://getback.barryeames.com (including Spectrum ST)

Barry
Hero, Legend, and all round good guy

Number of posts : 6119
Age : 71
Location : Port Weller, St. Catharines, Canada
Registration date : 2009-05-01

http://www.barryeames.com

Back to top Go down

Re: Concord III : Pots, Trem and Whammy advice

Post by Barry on Wed Sep 29, 2010 8:40 pm

grogg wrote:Before binning the tremolo block you could try a really good hard two part adhesive like one of the araldites.
I was wondering the same thing. It might repair it physically, but I suppose it wouldn't do much for the sustain. Still it does maintain the originality if that's a priority.

_________________
"A little song. A little dance. A little seltzer down your pants." -Chuckles the Clown


GUITARS : http://legend.barryeames.com/guitars.html
MUSIC/PIX/VIDEOS: http://getback.barryeames.com (including Spectrum ST)

Barry
Hero, Legend, and all round good guy

Number of posts : 6119
Age : 71
Location : Port Weller, St. Catharines, Canada
Registration date : 2009-05-01

http://www.barryeames.com

Back to top Go down

Re: Concord III : Pots, Trem and Whammy advice

Post by Racing on Thu Sep 30, 2010 4:51 am

Again.

No matter if the piece in case is out of pot metal or detroit wonder it comes down to the same thing...
Cast products are what´s known as chrystaline to the texture.
That brings that no matter what you do to the part it will NOT withstand force the same way being repaired as it did new.
In essence to the point where the word repaired can be questioned in most scenarios.

Racing
Hero, Legend, and all round good guy

Number of posts : 185
Age : 51
Registration date : 2009-02-27

Back to top Go down

Re: Concord III : Pots, Trem and Whammy advice

Post by Westbone on Thu Sep 30, 2010 5:35 am

If all else fails, try this, they go straight in and you can use the original saddles.
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=140307795432&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT

Westbone
Financial supporter

Number of posts : 4857
Location : Redbridge
Registration date : 2008-12-28

http://www.chruler.com/

Back to top Go down

Re: Concord III : Pots, Trem and Whammy advice

Post by Westbone on Thu Sep 30, 2010 5:48 am

Racing wrote:Again.

No matter if the piece in case is out of pot metal or detroit wonder it comes down to the same thing...
Cast products are what´s known as crystalline to the texture.
That brings that no matter what you do to the part it will NOT withstand force the same way being repaired as it did new.
In essence to the point where the word repaired can be questioned in most scenarios.


Throw away society bounce

Westbone
Financial supporter

Number of posts : 4857
Location : Redbridge
Registration date : 2008-12-28

http://www.chruler.com/

Back to top Go down

Re: Concord III : Pots, Trem and Whammy advice

Post by Barry on Thu Sep 30, 2010 8:30 am

Westbone wrote:If all else fails, try this, they go straight in and you can use the original saddles.
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=140307795432&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT
No sustain block on this one though. I just did a similar bridge replacement on an Aria Pro II Urchin. A Strat bridge (with block) dropped right in, no worries. Just be sure the saddle centres are 10.5 mm and not American spacing.

_________________
"A little song. A little dance. A little seltzer down your pants." -Chuckles the Clown


GUITARS : http://legend.barryeames.com/guitars.html
MUSIC/PIX/VIDEOS: http://getback.barryeames.com (including Spectrum ST)

Barry
Hero, Legend, and all round good guy

Number of posts : 6119
Age : 71
Location : Port Weller, St. Catharines, Canada
Registration date : 2009-05-01

http://www.barryeames.com

Back to top Go down

Re: Concord III : Pots, Trem and Whammy advice

Post by Westbone on Thu Sep 30, 2010 8:56 am

Look closer Barry, there is a sustain block. This is the same.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/NEW-TREMOLO-BRIDGE-STRAT-ETC-GOLD-BLACK-CHROME-/150431204166?pt=UK_Guitar_Accessories&hash=item2306660346

Westbone
Financial supporter

Number of posts : 4857
Location : Redbridge
Registration date : 2008-12-28

http://www.chruler.com/

Back to top Go down

Re: Concord III : Pots, Trem and Whammy advice

Post by Barry on Thu Sep 30, 2010 9:11 am

Westbone wrote:Look closer Barry, there is a sustain block. This is the same.
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/NEW-TREMOLO-BRIDGE-STRAT-ETC-GOLD-BLACK-CHROME-/150431204166?pt=UK_Guitar_Accessories&hash=item2306660346
Yeah this link does. Your first link shows a bridge only, hence the comment. Cool

_________________
"A little song. A little dance. A little seltzer down your pants." -Chuckles the Clown


GUITARS : http://legend.barryeames.com/guitars.html
MUSIC/PIX/VIDEOS: http://getback.barryeames.com (including Spectrum ST)

Barry
Hero, Legend, and all round good guy

Number of posts : 6119
Age : 71
Location : Port Weller, St. Catharines, Canada
Registration date : 2009-05-01

http://www.barryeames.com

Back to top Go down

Re: Concord III : Pots, Trem and Whammy advice

Post by corsair on Thu Sep 30, 2010 11:28 am

I used a Wilkinson 5+1 in my X195 and it worked a treat... straight drop-in... no worries!!! Cool

_________________
FWIW, an after market esoteric nut is a solution to a problem that doesn't exist, and a great way to convert your money into someone else’s.

corsair
Administrator

Number of posts : 5248
Age : 57
Location : Hervey Bay, Australia.
Registration date : 2008-04-08

Back to top Go down

Re: Concord III : Pots, Trem and Whammy advice

Post by Westbone on Thu Sep 30, 2010 1:04 pm

Barry, should have gone to 'eyes R us'
What is the bridge standing on?
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=140307795432&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT
Laughing

Westbone
Financial supporter

Number of posts : 4857
Location : Redbridge
Registration date : 2008-12-28

http://www.chruler.com/

Back to top Go down

Re: Concord III : Pots, Trem and Whammy advice

Post by Barry on Thu Sep 30, 2010 5:13 pm

Oh. Sorry. Doesn't exactly jump out at ya. Looks more like a shadow at that angle.

_________________
"A little song. A little dance. A little seltzer down your pants." -Chuckles the Clown


GUITARS : http://legend.barryeames.com/guitars.html
MUSIC/PIX/VIDEOS: http://getback.barryeames.com (including Spectrum ST)

Barry
Hero, Legend, and all round good guy

Number of posts : 6119
Age : 71
Location : Port Weller, St. Catharines, Canada
Registration date : 2009-05-01

http://www.barryeames.com

Back to top Go down

Re: Concord III : Pots, Trem and Whammy advice

Post by Guest on Thu Sep 30, 2010 5:40 pm

Westbone wrote:The trem. arm on a Concord III is indeed 6mm.
unless it isn't - I think this comes under 'specifications subject to change without notice'. Mine's definitely 5mm thread, the hole in the top of the trem is 5.23mm. I think it depends on when it was made - yours has an arm like the ones in the 83 catalogue, mine has one like the ones in the 82/3 catalogue, with the white plastic tip. I'm guessing mines an 82, can't be sure as it has no serial number.

Guest
Guest


Back to top Go down

Re: Concord III : Pots, Trem and Whammy advice

Post by Westbone on Thu Sep 30, 2010 5:48 pm

Yeah, Took a good look at the catalogue and look's like quite a few things are 'mixed' during those years.

Westbone
Financial supporter

Number of posts : 4857
Location : Redbridge
Registration date : 2008-12-28

http://www.chruler.com/

Back to top Go down

Re: Concord III : Pots, Trem and Whammy advice

Post by AngelPDX on Fri Oct 01, 2010 12:38 pm

You can try JB Weld for a temp repair, but like has been said, it's pot metal, it won't last. I have an '88 Corsair xa1430BUP and I'm seeking a trem bar for it. Anyone? I've got a trem bar that came in the bag when I bought it but doesn't fit it. It has a grey plether bag that says swarovski on it. Sad

AngelPDX
Registered Member

Number of posts : 9
Registration date : 2010-10-01

Back to top Go down

Re: Concord III : Pots, Trem and Whammy advice

Post by DreamRaven on Fri Oct 01, 2010 12:46 pm

There IS a sustain block on the first link, but it happens to be quite close in colour to the background it is sat on...



pirat

DreamRaven
Senior Member

Number of posts : 172
Registration date : 2009-09-06

Back to top Go down

Re: Concord III : Pots, Trem and Whammy advice

Post by corsair on Fri Oct 01, 2010 3:16 pm

AngelPDX wrote:I have an '88 Corsair xa1430BUP and I'm seeking a trem bar for it. Anyone?

If it's a Bendmaster Deluxe - nasticanasta's favourite trem in the whole wide world!! - then look around in here...

http://www.westone.info/spares/index.html

..if not, then possibly Stewmac or similar may have one to fit, probably 6mm fine.

_________________
FWIW, an after market esoteric nut is a solution to a problem that doesn't exist, and a great way to convert your money into someone else’s.

corsair
Administrator

Number of posts : 5248
Age : 57
Location : Hervey Bay, Australia.
Registration date : 2008-04-08

Back to top Go down

Re: Concord III : Pots, Trem and Whammy advice

Post by AngelPDX on Fri Oct 01, 2010 3:53 pm

corsair wrote:
AngelPDX wrote:I have an '88 Corsair xa1430BUP and I'm seeking a trem bar for it. Anyone?

If it's a Bendmaster Deluxe - nasticanasta's favourite trem in the whole wide world!! - then look around in here...

http://www.westone.info/spares/index.html

..if not, then possibly Stewmac or similar may have one to fit, probably 6mm fine.

Thanks, I appreciate the information. I found that site and can get a chrome one there, but since my Corsair is burgundy pearl with a black Bendmaster Deluxe, I'm looking for a black one to keep the look right. *shrug* but of course, anything will do to make it useable.

AngelPDX
Registered Member

Number of posts : 9
Registration date : 2010-10-01

Back to top Go down

Re: Concord III : Pots, Trem and Whammy advice

Post by Barry on Fri Oct 01, 2010 5:00 pm

AngelPDX wrote:...I found that site and can get a chrome one there, but...I'm looking for a black one to keep the look right...
Strange. I recently bought a plain black one for a Spectrum GT: $USD6.81 (plus shipping $USD8.95) for a total of $USD15.76. The StewMac model number is 1514-B (black).

_________________
"A little song. A little dance. A little seltzer down your pants." -Chuckles the Clown


GUITARS : http://legend.barryeames.com/guitars.html
MUSIC/PIX/VIDEOS: http://getback.barryeames.com (including Spectrum ST)

Barry
Hero, Legend, and all round good guy

Number of posts : 6119
Age : 71
Location : Port Weller, St. Catharines, Canada
Registration date : 2009-05-01

http://www.barryeames.com

Back to top Go down

Re: Concord III : Pots, Trem and Whammy advice

Post by Guest on Fri Oct 01, 2010 6:17 pm

AngelPDX wrote: I'm looking for a black one to keep the look right. *shrug* but of course, anything will do to make it useable.
All the Bendmaster Deluxe trems I've seen have had Chrome arms, even the black ones.

Guest
Guest


Back to top Go down

Re: Concord III : Pots, Trem and Whammy advice

Post by Westbone on Wed Oct 06, 2010 6:44 am

Another 'busted'Concord tremblock and it is a 5mm (arm) one. Obviously the hole is to close to the outside of the block.




Uploaded with ImageShack.us
All cast as one, bollax.

Westbone
Financial supporter

Number of posts : 4857
Location : Redbridge
Registration date : 2008-12-28

http://www.chruler.com/

Back to top Go down

Re: Concord III : Pots, Trem and Whammy advice

Post by Barry on Wed Oct 06, 2010 9:00 am

For a guy who conceived so many wonderful guitars, Uncle Mats sure had his troubles with bridges!! Chalk up another failed design.
The concept of a single casted trem is a good one...as long as you don't screw it up by tapping the thread for the arm too close to the edge! No
Not many options unfortunately; hard tail it, or replace it.

_________________
"A little song. A little dance. A little seltzer down your pants." -Chuckles the Clown


GUITARS : http://legend.barryeames.com/guitars.html
MUSIC/PIX/VIDEOS: http://getback.barryeames.com (including Spectrum ST)

Barry
Hero, Legend, and all round good guy

Number of posts : 6119
Age : 71
Location : Port Weller, St. Catharines, Canada
Registration date : 2009-05-01

http://www.barryeames.com

Back to top Go down

Re: Concord III : Pots, Trem and Whammy advice

Post by Westbone on Wed Oct 06, 2010 12:21 pm

All is not lost, tap it back and as long as you don't jump on it, should be OK bounce Might even melt it back.
There's plenty of replacement trems out there. Just as good if not better quality, can always use the brass saddles again and a 'big' solid block. GFS rings a bell.Guitarfetish afro man.
http://www.guitarfetish.com/105mm-GOLD-quotImportquot-quotMade-in-Mexicoquot-BRASS-BLOCK_p_1160.html

Westbone
Financial supporter

Number of posts : 4857
Location : Redbridge
Registration date : 2008-12-28

http://www.chruler.com/

Back to top Go down

Re: Concord III : Pots, Trem and Whammy advice

Post by fret_burn on Mon Oct 11, 2010 5:45 pm

Sorry, didn't realise there were so many replies, i thought i had subscribed to the thread but hey ho...

Westbone wrote:If all else fails, try this, they go straight in and you can use the original saddles.
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=140307795432&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT

Thanks alot, that should fit... if only it wasn't so shiny!

Thorn wrote:
Westbone wrote:The trem. arm on a Concord III is indeed 6mm.
unless it isn't - I think this comes under 'specifications subject to change without notice'. Mine's definitely 5mm thread, the hole in the top of the trem is 5.23mm. I think it depends on when it was made - yours has an arm like the ones in the 83 catalogue, mine has one like the ones in the 82/3 catalogue, with the white plastic tip. I'm guessing mines an 82, can't be sure as it has no serial number.

Mine looks like it will take a 6mm arm and is an '83 model.

It's too late now as i'm going for a natural look on the body but is it possible to get the pearl white paint? I couldn't find it anywhere and didn't want to just spray it white.

Thanks again for all the help.


fret_burn
Registered Member

Number of posts : 5
Registration date : 2010-09-28

Back to top Go down

Re: Concord III : Pots, Trem and Whammy advice

Post by Barry on Tue Nov 09, 2010 9:42 pm

fret_burn wrote:...is it possible to get the pearl white paint? I couldn't find it anywhere and didn't want to just spray it white.
No, at least not off the shelf AFAIK. The original paint on these babies was a catalyzed polyester and tough as nails!

You can possibly replicate that finish using Imron paints if you have access to the spray equipment or someone who can do it for you. As for the colours, they we based on Toyota colours of the period. You should be able to look up the colour specs online.

The tricky part is getting the pearl finish. That requires an iridescent powder additive. A custom auto repair shop would know how to do that.

_________________
"A little song. A little dance. A little seltzer down your pants." -Chuckles the Clown


GUITARS : http://legend.barryeames.com/guitars.html
MUSIC/PIX/VIDEOS: http://getback.barryeames.com (including Spectrum ST)

Barry
Hero, Legend, and all round good guy

Number of posts : 6119
Age : 71
Location : Port Weller, St. Catharines, Canada
Registration date : 2009-05-01

http://www.barryeames.com

Back to top Go down

Re: Concord III : Pots, Trem and Whammy advice

Post by Sponsored content Today at 11:35 pm


Sponsored content


Back to top Go down

View previous topic View next topic Back to top

- Similar topics

 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum