Kahler "Standard Cam String Hook" FTW

View previous topic View next topic Go down

Kahler "Standard Cam String Hook" FTW

Post by m-m-m on Thu Dec 23, 2010 2:11 am

So, we're all familiar with the problems with the Bendmaster FT and replacing the "string claws" (as they've been called here recently) that hold the ball end. When you've got a broken one you can loop the string around and through the ball end, but you end up loosing the fine tuning and it's kind of a pain in the ass to get right. Recently I found a bridge similar to the Bendmaster FT, so I took apart both bridges as a first step to see what I could do with them. Follow this link for the full story if you wish

It had been about 5 years since the last time I disassembled the BM, and forgot that one of my "string claws" was different from the others, meaning that it was a replacement!

I restarted my search for a replacement. I found lots of bridges that use "string claws": Gibson TP-6 and various Schaller models are out there, but can't find any parts for them. Eventually I started looking at kahler trems and found a link to a site called wammi world. After doing some reading I found a link for this part - the Standard Cam String Hook!.

I compared the one that's been on my Low E for as long as I've owned the trem, and I'm sure that it's the same thing.
here's a shot of the westone version on top and the kahler version on bottom

So you can obviously tell that the Kahler hook is a bit shorter. Good news is that it's long enough for it to make contact with the end of the fine tuner adjustment screw and function. This next shot came out a bit blurry, but the Kahler hook is on the high E (the rounded one) next to a westone one on the B.

If it weren't for the fact that the kahler hook has been on my guitar and functioning for the past 8 years, I might be concerned about it's length. The fact is that it works. Keep in mind that I've never used the whammy on my Westone, and I don't use the fine tuners much either ... as always your mileage may vary. But I can tell you one thing for sure, even if you remove the fine tuner screw the kahler will work and hold the ball end of the string.

Wammi World appears to ship worldwide, but I've also found a European supplier as well -
Banzai Music out of Germany (NOTE: the part number from banzai is the same as the one from wammi world except it has an 'X' after it ... not sure if that's significant or not. Both parts look the same from the pictures.)

I plan on ordering a couple in the morning. I wouldn't be completely surprised if I had to grab my drill and ream the hole on the hook out a bit, but I'm hoping that won't be necessary. I'll keep everyone posted. Very Happy

UPDATE!
I just got mine in, and it looks like I'll have to get out a couple of small files and make them just the slightest bit narrower to get them to work. Less than a 1/64th of an inch, I'm sure. I'd be more precise, but I don't own dial calipers.


Last edited by m-m-m on Sat Jan 01, 2011 1:21 pm; edited 1 time in total

m-m-m
Westone Nut

Number of posts : 52
Location : near Chicago
Registration date : 2010-12-08

Back to top Go down

Re: Kahler "Standard Cam String Hook" FTW

Post by corsair on Thu Dec 23, 2010 3:09 am

You, sir, are a bottler; well bloody done!! I, too, shall order a couple.... just in case, you understand! Very Happy

Thank you for the research done, mate.... you've made my Xmas just that wee bit better!! cheers

_________________
FWIW, an after market esoteric nut is a solution to a problem that doesn't exist, and a great way to convert your money into someone else’s.

corsair
Administrator

Number of posts : 5209
Age : 57
Location : Hervey Bay, Australia.
Registration date : 2008-04-08

Back to top Go down

Re: Kahler "Standard Cam String Hook" FTW

Post by m-m-m on Thu Dec 23, 2010 11:36 am

Never been called a bottler before. That's absolutely bonzer.

m-m-m
Westone Nut

Number of posts : 52
Location : near Chicago
Registration date : 2010-12-08

Back to top Go down

Re: Kahler "Standard Cam String Hook" FTW

Post by corsair on Thu Dec 23, 2010 11:48 am

Laughing Laughing ... as in "... should be bottled and sold!"

I've been in contact with them and there are a selection of small bits heading my way as we speak... cheers

_________________
FWIW, an after market esoteric nut is a solution to a problem that doesn't exist, and a great way to convert your money into someone else’s.

corsair
Administrator

Number of posts : 5209
Age : 57
Location : Hervey Bay, Australia.
Registration date : 2008-04-08

Back to top Go down

Re: Kahler "Standard Cam String Hook" FTW

Post by Barry on Thu Dec 23, 2010 4:40 pm

Don't have this problem (or trem...yet) but it's nice to know that there's a potential solution for those who are tearing their hair out!
Well done and thanks for the research on this!

_________________
"A little song. A little dance. A little seltzer down your pants." -Chuckles the Clown


GUITARS : http://legend.barryeames.com/guitars.html
MUSIC/PIX/VIDEOS: http://getback.barryeames.com (including Spectrum ST)

Barry
Hero, Legend, and all round good guy

Number of posts : 6021
Age : 71
Location : Port Weller, St. Catharines, Canada
Registration date : 2009-05-01

http://www.barryeames.com

Back to top Go down

Re: Kahler "Standard Cam String Hook" FTW

Post by Westbone on Thu Dec 23, 2010 5:33 pm

Always wondered what FT stands for. Friggin' Trash.
Seems a lot of folks have the same problem.
Looks like a good fix 3m.

Westbone
Financial supporter

Number of posts : 4778
Location : Redbridge
Registration date : 2008-12-28

http://www.chruler.com/

Back to top Go down

Re: Kahler "Standard Cam String Hook" FTW

Post by m-m-m on Thu Dec 23, 2010 6:33 pm

Westbone wrote:Always wondered what FT stands for. Friggin' Trash.
Seems a lot of folks have the same problem.
Looks like a good fix 3m.

Floating trem? Fugly turd? Fairly touchy? Fine tuner? Funky thingamabob? Fish tacos?

m-m-m
Westone Nut

Number of posts : 52
Location : near Chicago
Registration date : 2010-12-08

Back to top Go down

Re: Kahler "Standard Cam String Hook" FTW

Post by Westbone on Thu Dec 23, 2010 8:58 pm

Floating Turd.

Westbone
Financial supporter

Number of posts : 4778
Location : Redbridge
Registration date : 2008-12-28

http://www.chruler.com/

Back to top Go down

Re: Kahler "Standard Cam String Hook" FTW

Post by m-m-m on Thu Dec 23, 2010 10:00 pm

lol

m-m-m
Westone Nut

Number of posts : 52
Location : near Chicago
Registration date : 2010-12-08

Back to top Go down

Re: Kahler "Standard Cam String Hook" FTW

Post by Barry on Tue Jan 24, 2012 10:55 am

And if you decide to replace the whole thing: Replacement

_________________
"A little song. A little dance. A little seltzer down your pants." -Chuckles the Clown


GUITARS : http://legend.barryeames.com/guitars.html
MUSIC/PIX/VIDEOS: http://getback.barryeames.com (including Spectrum ST)

Barry
Hero, Legend, and all round good guy

Number of posts : 6021
Age : 71
Location : Port Weller, St. Catharines, Canada
Registration date : 2009-05-01

http://www.barryeames.com

Back to top Go down

Re: Kahler "Standard Cam String Hook" FTW

Post by m-m-m on Tue Apr 30, 2013 7:18 pm

Barry wrote:And if you decide to replace the whole thing: Replacement

doh! wish I woulda logged in a few weeks ago. I'll have to start a new epic post soon …

m-m-m
Westone Nut

Number of posts : 52
Location : near Chicago
Registration date : 2010-12-08

Back to top Go down

Re: Kahler "Standard Cam String Hook" FTW

Post by Barry on Tue Apr 30, 2013 7:25 pm

Roll on Floor Laff Ya snooooozzzz....ya loozzzzz!

_________________
"A little song. A little dance. A little seltzer down your pants." -Chuckles the Clown


GUITARS : http://legend.barryeames.com/guitars.html
MUSIC/PIX/VIDEOS: http://getback.barryeames.com (including Spectrum ST)

Barry
Hero, Legend, and all round good guy

Number of posts : 6021
Age : 71
Location : Port Weller, St. Catharines, Canada
Registration date : 2009-05-01

http://www.barryeames.com

Back to top Go down

Re: Kahler "Standard Cam String Hook" FTW

Post by fragmentalstew on Wed Jul 09, 2014 5:22 am

I ordered 4 of these, after reading this thread, and they're actually more like 3/64 too wide.  If I had known that, I think I would have saved myself some trouble and tried to get a whole new bridge like Barry linked to.

I may need a better file,  or maybe some kind of power tool.  After many hours of physical effort I finally got one of the hooks filed down where it's usable.  I gripped the hook in my fingers and it would get hot over time and burn my fingers.  I tried wearing gloves but the gloves would rub against the file.  I tried holding the hook in vice grips, but I ended up breaking the hook.

The paint takes some time to file through, and then there is a hard metal coating kind of like chrome, followed by another hard coating that's sort of a brass color.  The chrome like coating takes the most time to file through.  It's a pita. After those three coatings are gone, the  hook is considerably easier to file.  I wonder if removing those coatings compromises the structural integrity of the hook.  Also, the back edge of the hook sits further back than the originals, which prevents the hook from reclining all the way back.

fragmentalstew
Registered Member

Number of posts : 4
Registration date : 2014-07-09

Back to top Go down

Re: Kahler "Standard Cam String Hook" FTW

Post by corsair on Wed Jul 09, 2014 7:17 am

Strewth!! You're keen; I held mine against the side of the grinding wheel on my bench grinders' fine stone held in the (soft) jaws of a pair of vice grips: had the 1.2mm whacked off in very short order, without hot fingies!!

You're right, though; they're not perfect but they are the only way of easily getting an FT bridge up and running!!

_________________
FWIW, an after market esoteric nut is a solution to a problem that doesn't exist, and a great way to convert your money into someone else’s.

corsair
Administrator

Number of posts : 5209
Age : 57
Location : Hervey Bay, Australia.
Registration date : 2008-04-08

Back to top Go down

Re: Kahler "Standard Cam String Hook" FTW

Post by m-m-m on Wed Jul 09, 2014 12:11 pm

Well, I have a nice set of digital calipers now, so I'll have to measure the ones that I got. Considering that your filing experience sounds much different than mine it makes me wonder if they changed the part somehow. It's been a while, but I don't recall having that much of an issue. Maybe, as you suggested, your file is too dull.

m-m-m
Westone Nut

Number of posts : 52
Location : near Chicago
Registration date : 2010-12-08

Back to top Go down

Re: Kahler "Standard Cam String Hook" FTW

Post by fragmentalstew on Wed Jul 09, 2014 3:57 pm

corsair wrote:Strewth!! You're keen; I held mine against the side of the grinding wheel on my bench grinders' fine stone held in the (soft) jaws of a pair of vice grips: had the 1.2mm whacked off in very short order, without hot fingies!!

You're right, though; they're not perfect but they are the only way of easily getting an FT bridge up and running!!
How do you grip them in the vice grips?  I either gripped mine in the wrong location, or too tight.

fragmentalstew
Registered Member

Number of posts : 4
Registration date : 2014-07-09

Back to top Go down

Re: Kahler "Standard Cam String Hook" FTW

Post by corsair on Wed Jul 09, 2014 4:04 pm

I lined the jaws with leather cut from an old belt and held it so that 1 side was available to the grinding wheel.

_________________
FWIW, an after market esoteric nut is a solution to a problem that doesn't exist, and a great way to convert your money into someone else’s.

corsair
Administrator

Number of posts : 5209
Age : 57
Location : Hervey Bay, Australia.
Registration date : 2008-04-08

Back to top Go down

Re: Kahler "Standard Cam String Hook" FTW

Post by fragmentalstew on Wed Jul 09, 2014 6:35 pm

corsair wrote:I lined the jaws with leather cut from an old belt and held it so that 1 side was available to the grinding wheel.
Thanks.  Where are you actually applying the grip?  I had mine on the bend and the forks, which is how I broke one side of the forks.  I had trouble gripping to the other surfaces because they are so uneven.

For reference, I'm including a picture of the hook with with labels I made up.


Last edited by fragmentalstew on Wed Jul 09, 2014 6:36 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : typo)

fragmentalstew
Registered Member

Number of posts : 4
Registration date : 2014-07-09

Back to top Go down

Re: Kahler "Standard Cam String Hook" FTW

Post by corsair on Thu Jul 10, 2014 2:13 am

OK ... you don't need to grip the thing REAL tight; just tight enough for it not to move when placed lightly against the side - side, not the normal grinding face!!! - of your bench grinder or Dremel-in-a-vice setup!! Very Happy 

I think, from rather shonky memory, that I used a set of welders grips with the widened jaws, that I had ground a little to make it fit square. The leather cushions and helps hold the claw and I recall it didn't take long to remove the metal. I think I polished the raw edges with a warding file set in the vice and then Autosol cream.

_________________
FWIW, an after market esoteric nut is a solution to a problem that doesn't exist, and a great way to convert your money into someone else’s.

corsair
Administrator

Number of posts : 5209
Age : 57
Location : Hervey Bay, Australia.
Registration date : 2008-04-08

Back to top Go down

Re: Kahler "Standard Cam String Hook" FTW

Post by m-m-m on Thu Jul 10, 2014 12:30 pm

OK, from measuring at the bend with my digital calipers

Original Westone: 0.2155"
Kahler: 0.2375
Difference: 0.022
1/64= 0.01563
1/32= 0.03125

So, I stand corrected. Not less than 1/64th, but more like 1.5/64th or 3/128th if proper fractions are your thing. If the ones you got are indeed 3/64ths wider, than that must mean that either quality control sucks or they are getting 'em from a different manufacturer that that isn't making them to the same spec as the ones that I got.

m-m-m
Westone Nut

Number of posts : 52
Location : near Chicago
Registration date : 2010-12-08

Back to top Go down

Re: Kahler "Standard Cam String Hook" FTW

Post by corsair on Thu Jul 10, 2014 5:08 pm

Makes sense to me; it happened very quickly when I did it.

_________________
FWIW, an after market esoteric nut is a solution to a problem that doesn't exist, and a great way to convert your money into someone else’s.

corsair
Administrator

Number of posts : 5209
Age : 57
Location : Hervey Bay, Australia.
Registration date : 2008-04-08

Back to top Go down

Re: Kahler "Standard Cam String Hook" FTW

Post by fragmentalstew on Sun Jul 13, 2014 8:59 am

I used a belt sander, and Held the part with a metal rod that fit in the hole, and a wooden paint stirring stick with a notch taken out.  Probably not the best control.  Didn't get the most even edges, but worked alright. I forgot to measure it before grinding.

fragmentalstew
Registered Member

Number of posts : 4
Registration date : 2014-07-09

Back to top Go down

Re: Kahler "Standard Cam String Hook" FTW

Post by Sponsored content Today at 6:15 am


Sponsored content


Back to top Go down

View previous topic View next topic Back to top

- Similar topics

 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum