Rebuilding a Westone (Korean)

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Re: Rebuilding a Westone (Korean)

Post by grogg on Tue Dec 06, 2011 4:44 pm

Have bought from these too, they do damaged stock clearance sometimes and the damage is fairly minimal. Link

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Re: Rebuilding a Westone (Korean)

Post by Westbone on Wed Dec 07, 2011 6:11 pm

I think your problem here is the neck you've bought.
The fingerboard on your new one is hanging over more at the body end, position of the frets, obviously pro rate to the bridge. The Westone neck fret positions are roughly 1 cm more up towards the headstock.
Suppose a well made spacer could solve your problems or search for another neck.

Look at the position of the fingerboard on this one, you'll get my drift.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Banana-Maple-Guitar-Neck-rosewood-Fingerboard-22-Fret-/130465664390?pt=UK_Guitar_Accessories&hash=item1e605c0d86

Yours is more like this.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/New-High-Quality-Unfinished-electric-guitar-neck-/270842837039?pt=Guitar&hash=item3f0f7db82f

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Re: Rebuilding a Westone (Korean)

Post by beavis on Sat Dec 17, 2011 3:01 pm

Hello guys, I'm really sorry I haven't replied before to your posts.

Westbone I do get your point. I actually got my neck at the second link you posted (because it's cheap, allowing me to scallop it and screw the whole thing up without wasting excessive amounts of cash).

I fear that by gettin any other neck (with no fretboard overhang), the problem may only be reduced but not solved. I might just end up needing a 0.7cm spacer instead of a 1.x cm one... In such a case, I am not overly motivated to spend 100 on another neck when I hardly spent more thatn 60-70 on the rest.

I could ask for somebody (the ebay guys in China for instance) to make me a 25.5 scale neck but which would be 1.5cm longer...

Another problem: if I did get a spacer glued on to the neck, the bolt screws would go right into the place where the spacer is glued to the neck.. Might be fragile.

Thanks for all the links and advice!!


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Re: Rebuilding a Westone (Korean)

Post by hoax on Sat Dec 17, 2011 3:27 pm

I have read this quickly and it looks as though all you have to do is fit a little spacer at the rear of your neck pocket to throw the neck further away from the bridge. Its a 10 minute job.

So long as nut to 12th fret and 12th fret to bridge saddle distance are the same then there is no problem.

I regularly cut the last fret from strat necks so that they fit teles. This is just the opposite of the same problem i.e. making the 12th fret equidistant with regard to bridge and nut.

I think that this is what others are saying, but maybe I am just explaining differently or I have missed something.

If the screw holes are an issue, just move the neck plate?

Hoax

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Re: Rebuilding a Westone (Korean)

Post by Westbone on Sat Dec 17, 2011 9:36 pm

That was only an exaggerated example of the problem you have. Didn't mean that the other neck will do the job.

The Westone neck's are somewhere in between those.

Have a look a the position of the last fret to the end of the neck, not the fingerboard, on the red one below. Also the second link highlights it a wee bit clearer.
http://www.westoneguitars.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/p44.jpg

http://www.westoneguitars.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/076.jpg

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Re: Rebuilding a Westone (Korean)

Post by beavis on Sun Dec 18, 2011 2:48 pm

hoax wrote:I have read this quickly and it looks as though all you have to do is fit a little spacer at the rear of your neck pocket to throw the neck further away from the bridge. Its a 10 minute job.

Hoax

Thanks a lot for your optimism! sunny As for moving the neck plate, well there isn't any and the body is already routed/drilled. My idea at the moment, is to shorten the neck about .3-.4 cm, and stick a spacer on to it. Would you glue the spacer to the neck pocket or to the neck itself btw?

Westbone: thanks for the extra links, they are very explicit. The westone neck on my dynasty seems quite similar to the one I have, but I am too leasy to unbolt it just to compare. It looks like my neck is built to strat us neck measurements, which are pretty much the standard now in retail necks I guess.

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Re: Rebuilding a Westone (Korean)

Post by Westbone on Sun Dec 18, 2011 8:32 pm

Why shorten the neck, you're making your problem worse. Going about this arse about face.
The necks to short already. Why cut some off to then make a spacer??

There's a short overhang of the fingerboard, glue a piece on the end of the neck, the overhang will make for a better joint as it'll be glued to the end of the neck and to the overhang. Just bring it all flush.

Or buy a new one that fits.

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Re: Rebuilding a Westone (Korean)

Post by beavis on Mon Dec 19, 2011 3:04 am

Oh right, I wasn't very precise. The end of the neck is rounded, which makes it complicated to build a spacer (filing the neck flat would make it easier) and also prevent the screws from going strait into the joint.

I think I might go the spacer way before trying to buy a new neck because I don't want to end up with another neck that doesn't fit right either. Guess all I need now is to find a good piece of hard maple, some tools and, last but not least, Time! santa


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Re: Rebuilding a Westone (Korean)

Post by beavis on Wed Jan 11, 2012 3:44 pm

Ok! Things are moving along nicely and a spacer has been put on the neck as you can see in the picture:



The neck has not been drilled nore screwed on to the body yet, so I do not yet know if the spacer will hold. But for the time being, the shape is right and it seems generally solid. Wait and see I suppose.

Now for the tasty part: how to wire all the pick-ups???

As you can see on the body there are two "big" holes and 3 smaller ones. The parts I intend to install are: GFS rail PU in the neck position, lace sensor gold in the middle, unidentified 12k ohms Seymour Duncan humbucker in the bridge. Now I don't know how to wire it. My idea is this:
first big hole, volume 500k pot.
2nd big hole: 3 way selector switch, but looks like it might get in the way of the trem arm...
Little hole 1: coil-split dpdt switch
Little hole 2: series-parallel dpdt switch
Little hole 3: dunno, phase reversal, but don't know what phase reversal sounds like, kill switch, tone pot, just don't know.

Any comments?

Love you all!

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Re: Rebuilding a Westone (Korean)

Post by gittarasaurus on Wed Jan 11, 2012 5:07 pm

corsair wrote: all of those pickups have individual on/off switches; in the case of the h/b, 1 coil/off/2 coils; silly system and I dislike it!

so the original setup had:

master volume pot, master tone pot in the two larger holes closer to the bridge
the small holes were three mini switches to operate the pickups: neck pup on/off, middle pup on/off, bridge pup single/off/humbucker

putting it back in this configuration will not require modifying any of the holes. that is a plus in my book.

the advantage of this setup (3 mini switches) over a blade switch is that you can have all the pups on if you want. you can't do that with a typical blade switch. the 3-way switch you mentioned as a possibility is usually used for a 2 pickup guitar.

using the 3 mini switches as originally designed, you could also make the tone control a push/pull pot for a phase reverse or series parallel connections. again, no modifications to the body necessary.

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Re: Rebuilding a Westone (Korean)

Post by Westbone on Wed Jan 11, 2012 6:12 pm

Your going to need something like this.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2-set-Guitar-Bass-Neck-Joint-System-Kit-INSERT-SCREW-/300582550453?pt=Guitar_Accessories&hash=item45fc1dbbb5

The screws/bolts will have to be cut to size as the front two are shorter the the others.

And you'll need something like these to sit in the body
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Guitar-bass-neck-joint-Bushings-/140660899884?pt=UK_Guitar_Accessories&var=&hash=item66742a6010

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Re: Rebuilding a Westone (Korean)

Post by Iceman on Wed Jan 11, 2012 8:25 pm

More often than not a phase reverse adds abit of quirkiness to the sound and thins it our somewhat as well. At least what I've experienced but of course YMMV.

Maybe look into adding an option taking two of the pups out of parallel with each other when both on instead? Good to hear you are plugging away at it man!

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Re: Rebuilding a Westone (Korean)

Post by beavis on Thu Jan 12, 2012 6:24 am

Great, thanks for all the info!!!

I might sound conservative here, but I have trouble seeing the point of using three switches instead of one selector switch (apart from the fact that you get to do combinations, but who does that anyway...). And my wonderful ( sunny ) dimension IV only has a 3 way switch (with that funny mid-pup switch too) and gets away pretty well with it.

Iceman: you confirm what I heard/read about phase reversal, and I am not yet ready to play britpopgonegrunge stuff yet, so I'll drop it (thanks for your support BTW).

Westbone, I see you are a great promoter of those neck bolts, but why is it so essential? I am thinking of just using simple wood screws as two of the screws will go nearly right in to where the spacer is glued to the neck and I want to avoid drilling too big a hole if I can help it. I am going to order those bushings though, exactly what I need.

What about this: master volume, master tone, 3 way selector switch (or 5way, but I don't think 5 way toggle switches exist, especially none that would fit in the smaller hole), coil split switch, series parallel switch. If I want more tonal possibilities later on, I could always replace one of the master pots with a push-pull, for instance to "activate" the mid pup whatever pup is selected, like on the dim IV.

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Re: Rebuilding a Westone (Korean)

Post by Westbone on Thu Jan 12, 2012 12:47 pm

Well the original neck had inserts with bolts..
You'll notice that the holes in the body are a lot larger than a body that uses ordinary scews, a la Fender type.
So if you use those the screws will flop about making the neck unstable. Hence you will need the bushings for definate anyway whatever you choose to use. Make sure you get a good fit or as near as.
If you do use the inserts put them in with Araldite or a similar 2 pack adhesive but they have to be exact.

And no I'm not promoting the bolts it's just that the design screams out for them.... Smile

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Re: Rebuilding a Westone (Korean)

Post by beavis on Fri Jan 13, 2012 3:02 am

Westbone, I am convinced, will order them later today. Though I do not quite understand how they work, does the insert go in at the base of the neck? I'll check to see if I can find bushings at the local hardware store first.

I was thinking about the original setup and have realised that I love being able to switch from humbucking bridge to single-coiled neck, might try to figure out some coil switch which would allow me to split both coils, no coils or only neck humbucker, sound good?

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Re: Rebuilding a Westone (Korean)

Post by Barry on Thu Jan 19, 2012 2:28 pm

beavis wrote:Westbone, I am convinced, will order them later today. Though I do not quite understand how they work, does the insert go in at the base of the neck? I'll check to see if I can find bushings at the local hardware store first...
You might find this project from Dan Erlewine helpful:
Take Apart Tele

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Re: Rebuilding a Westone (Korean)

Post by beavis on Thu Jan 19, 2012 3:56 pm

Barry! This would have been just perfect if it didn't look so difficult (yes I do sometimes get the screwdriver mixed up with the hammer) :heart:

Will read through it a few more times. It's exactly the walkthrough I need though!

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Re: Rebuilding a Westone (Korean)

Post by beavis on Sat Mar 24, 2012 4:40 pm

Back to work!

As mentioned in another thread, here are some pics of the neck on the body.





The screws are original fender wood screws (hard as nail btw). I had ordered those screws Westbone had posted the link to, but they never got here. And after 5 weeks of waiting, like the princess for her toad ro whatever princesses wait for, I was not ready to give it another try and got reimbursed.
I went to see the most knowledgeable luthier in the region who told me that the original screws in the guitar were probably not as wide as the hole anyway and standard wood screws would do the job. I know Westbone would disagree with this and it does surprise me too, but it is looking ok for the time being. This luthier also said I needn't worry about this wood plot that we added at the base of the neck. It isn't too pretty, but I don't mind it.

Next I am going to scallop the neck, full scallop probably. Will do this by using files. I don't have any dremmel or band sander and was told (by this same luthier) that files are the tools to use. Then I am going to paint the headstock, apply lacquer to the entire neck (if it survives the scalloping), route the trem cavity to allow for pull-ups with the floyd, eventually gouge out the cavity to allow for the springs to work freely (they might touch the would as the trem block is surely smaller/lower than the original, and deal with the electronics.

Talking about the latter, my idea for the time being is to use a master tone, master volume, 3way (neck, middle, bridge), 3-way for coil-split (neck and bridge - neck - neither) and a switch for series/parrallel or phase reversal. I am also thinking of using a push-pull pot on master tone or volume to get the 3-way PU selector to select both neck and bridge in the middle position instead of the middle pickup. Does this sound feasible?

My two big worries are
-the scalloping of the neck. But this has to be done, I can't stand small frets and they aren't actually very well installed (plus I want to have a scalloped neck);
- getting the floyd to work without the springs rubbing against the inside of the cavity.

Long post eh guys?! Hope the reading wasn't too unpleasant. pig

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Re: Rebuilding a Westone (Korean)

Post by Westbone on Sat Mar 24, 2012 8:48 pm

It's getting there Smile

Didn't say you couldn't use 'normal' type neck screws but they would not work without the black cups you are using.
The original neck fixing IS with inserts in the neck. But your happy now and can go scalloping Laughing

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Re: Rebuilding a Westone (Korean)

Post by Barry on Sat Mar 24, 2012 9:03 pm

your happy now and can go scalloping
Mmm, seafood! bounce

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Re: Rebuilding a Westone (Korean)

Post by beavis on Fri Jun 29, 2012 7:23 am

Hello all!

I am fishing this one from the lungs of oblivion (huh?), once more (as usual, if this is getting too off-subject, I will not take it personally if the admins wish to close it down).

The neck scallop is finished. I am pretty pleased with the overall result. The scallop remains quite shallow, but hopefully deep enough to make a difference. I will post pics this evening, or tomorrow.

My next step is to clear coat the neck and this is where I need some advice. I have searched the web a bit but have found a wide variety of possibilities and don't know what to do.

My idea was to buy a can of clear coat lacquer spray, spray on a few coats (2-3), while wet sanding with 800-1000 grit in between, stick the logo I've got, and spray on a few more (2-3) extra layers. Will this get the job (well) done?

I read that different types of lacquers should be used and that the coating should be finished with a nitrocellulose lacquer to seal the wood. Is this correct and or essential?

I also want to avoid having a high gloss finish. It just doesn't feel quite right, but maybe that's not the lacquer but just the buffing that produces that result.

I will be looking forward to reading your replies and I seize this opportunity to thank you all for keeping such a great forum alive. This forum is exceptional.

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Re: Rebuilding a Westone (Korean)

Post by beavis on Sun Jul 01, 2012 4:55 am

And here are a few pics. They aren't great, but should give an idea. Hmm, the pics now seem to want to appear above the text, odd.

One fret marker wasn't installed quite right and was already apparent on the fretboard before the scallop. I sort of filed around it, looks exotic. Hope it won't be a bother.

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Re: Rebuilding a Westone (Korean)

Post by The Chad on Mon Jul 02, 2012 3:06 pm

I don't yet know about finishes, but that scallped neck looks it'll be fun to play around with! Can't wait to hear how it feels and inspires once all done. Great job for goin' for it man.

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Re: Rebuilding a Westone (Korean)

Post by Sgt. Vimes on Mon Jul 02, 2012 4:11 pm

nice work beavis! I wouldnt have the balls to attempt something so dramatic, hats off to ya fella! Yay!

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Re: Rebuilding a Westone (Korean)

Post by Westbone on Mon Jul 02, 2012 4:15 pm

Looks as if you hit one or two frets with the file,oops!

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Re: Rebuilding a Westone (Korean)

Post by beavis on Tue Jul 03, 2012 4:22 am

Westbone wrote:Looks as if you hit one or two frets with the file,oops!

Hehe, well I actually didn't really hit the crown of the frets all "that much", but the ends/edges of the frets do look irregular. I actually used a nail file (one of those sandpaper girly ones) to file them down a bit because they were razor sharp. They will indeed need some more work though. I do agree that the work is a bit rustic, I am really new to this.

I do hope it will be fun to play! I also hope that it'll sound good. The scallop isn't very deep but it already took me a looooong time to get it done, around 15 minutes a fret probably. Bulked up my right arm though :bball: .

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Re: Rebuilding a Westone (Korean)

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