What's Wrong With Westone Guitar Prices?

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What's Wrong With Westone Guitar Prices?

Post by Brainfertilizer on Fri Apr 12, 2013 3:15 pm

I'm really surprised that I had to drop my 1989 Spectrum GT to a $90 starting price to get a starting bid on it. It didn't sell the first time at $99.

That guitar is a steal at $150 (I always put $50 shipping, for the same reasons Guitar Center and Music Go Round do), but there were no takers.

Also, just about 18 months ago me and someone else (sarcaster?) were fighting over who would get to bid on the yellow Dimension, and it ended up selling for something like $350 (far above what either of us were willing to pay). At the same time, there was a Dimension on Craigslist that they were asking nearly $400 for, and I think they eventually got it.

But as of this morning, my black Dimension had gotten no interest at $99 (+ $50 shipping).

WTF?

I know they are Korean models, but it isn't like I'm asking $400 or even $300 or even $250.

For a good long time, most of 2012, you couldn't get a Korean Westone for less than $200, regardless of bumps and bruises. Now it feels like I almost can't give them away.

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Re: What's Wrong With Westone Guitar Prices?

Post by Iceman on Fri Apr 12, 2013 3:45 pm

Well sir, since you're asking...

Purely a guess on my part but a flat $50 shipping fee may be the culprit, given there is no case coming with it. I've had guitars shipped to me in the case from every part of the good old US of A to Minnesota and the most I've paid with insurance and tracking still squeaked in at just under $30. One made it to me from the Jersey Shores with the neck removed for a touch over $18. Plenty of folks just immediately pass on considering an item when the shipping charge looks to be on the overly healthy side, no matter your reasons for doing so.

Stating you will only charge actual costs to ship and leaving the options of the carrier open for discussion always elevated those sellers a cut above in my eyes... just my personal opinion, mind you.

As an after thought perhaps the non-functional tremolo is raising flags as well.

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Re: What's Wrong With Westone Guitar Prices?

Post by Brainfertilizer on Fri Apr 12, 2013 4:02 pm

[color:3153=#000]Are you saying that $100 bid + $50 shipping is making it harder to sell than if I had $30 shipping and a $120 starting bid?

Also, are you also saying I will have a better chance of selling it at just $150 if I lie or otherwise obscure the actual truth about the guitar?

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Re: What's Wrong With Westone Guitar Prices?

Post by Brainfertilizer on Fri Apr 12, 2013 4:02 pm

[color:fd38=#000]Here's why I charge $50 shipping:

Guitars
weigh different amounts. Shipping materials weigh different amounts.
Guitar shipping boxes are different sizes. That changes the shipping
rate. USPS, Fed-Ex, and UPS all have different rate systems, so it is
impossible to know where the best shipping cost is, or what the total is
until the bidding ends.

Using UPS I've shipped guitars as cheap
as $20. I've also shipped guitars where the cost was $65 (to some small
town in the middle of nowhere, UPS shipping was higher). If I would have
demanded the buyer send me money to make up the difference, he would
have laughed, and rightfully so.

I usually ship UPS. If I ship
USPS, I use Priority mail. Parcel Post isn't just cheaper, they are much
more careless with the boxes. I've had 3 guitars damaged: 1 sending, 2
receiving. All three were Parcel Post.

Having a $50 charge is
open and obvious. Everyone includes the shipping charge in what they are
willing to pay. If you are willing to pay $200, then if the shipping is
$10: you bid $190; if the shipping charge is $80, you bid $120. The
guitar sells for the same total price of $200, the seller gets the same
amount, you pay the same amount.

If you REALLY want cheap
shipping, that means I have to pack the guitar, take it to the post
office to get a price, send you the invoice, wait for payment, then go
back to the post office to ship, and increase the chance of a damaged
guitar. After I add in the cost of shipping materials and my the cost
of my time for having to take TWO trips to ship one guitar, you might
save $15 or you might save $5. But then you wait longer for the guitar
and you have to accept the risk of damage.

If you order a guitar
from Guitar Center or other online store, they will charge you $50
shipping. I agree with their good reasons.

It is WAY TOO MUCH
hassle to charge actual shipping. And from my own guitar buying, it
makes zero difference in the final money out of pocket to the buyer, and
money in the pocket to the seller.


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Re: What's Wrong With Westone Guitar Prices?

Post by Brainfertilizer on Fri Apr 12, 2013 5:11 pm

That one was tough.
We couldn't ship in a normal guitar box, had to remove e neck and ship in a smaller box to save costs.

But it is tough finding a box wide enough for a guitar body, long enough for a guitar neck, but not so tall as to exceed requirements or have too much air space to fill.

I ended up cutting down a slightly larger box, but that didn't turn out well, it weakened the box. 3 trips across e Atlantic just made the "heavy crushing weight placed on top" inevitable, I think.

Normal shipping, I use Uline guitar boxes, very sturdy. If I'm using a used box and it seems flimsy at all, I double box with one of those smaller triangle shaped guitar boxes.

So I pack well.

And none of this answers why 12 months ago, you needed to spend at least $230 to $250 to get a playable MIK Westone, but now people aren't even nibbling at $150.

And the Vantage I have for sale, despite the rabid fandom of that name, despite being a Matumoku product in great shape (a few minor dings) didn't sell @ $210 shipped, and has one bidder right now: an Aussie willing to spend $240, but no Yanks willing to spend even $190 for a Matsumoku guitar.

It's almost enough to make me lose my faith in humanity.


Last edited by Brainfertilizer on Fri Apr 12, 2013 6:26 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Re: What's Wrong With Westone Guitar Prices?

Post by gittarasaurus on Fri Apr 12, 2013 5:42 pm

2 words:
the economy


from the Associated Press article...

"The percentage of Americans working or looking for jobs fell to 63.3 percent in March, the lowest such figure in nearly 34 years."

"In March, the number of people either working or looking for work fell by nearly 500,000. It was sharpest such drop since December 2010. And the number of Americans who said they were employed dropped nearly 210,000."

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Re: What's Wrong With Westone Guitar Prices?

Post by Brainfertilizer on Fri Apr 12, 2013 5:49 pm

True.
The current Depression that none dare admit is ruining lots of markets. I guess I thought last year was already the new normal (down significantly from several years ago when you couldn't get a Corsair for under $300...believe me, I tried!), and I didn't think it could get even worse.

I guess it did.

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Re: What's Wrong With Westone Guitar Prices?

Post by Iceman on Fri Apr 12, 2013 5:49 pm

Umm, okay... please forgive me for having an opinion.

If you ship even infrequently in this day and age you can get a very close approximation of cost by knowing the weight and dimensions of your package and using the online calculator that all carriers provide on their sites. I have never been off by more than a dollar when doing this so I can't see why multiple trips to the carrier are necessary.

I did not mean to insinuate that you should misrepresent or obscure any details about anything you sell, only that your honesty (kudos to you btw) of the condition may be raising other questions or just shutting down interest in your item.

Good for you for the care with which you package items for shipment. I try as well to be as protecting as possible when packaging something to send off and so far have not had your bad experiences sending or receiving a guitar (120 + now) and I've never spent more than $10 on materials necessary to do so.

Like it or not there still exists a spectre of hard feelings on ebay from lots of buyers who have experienced price padding in the form of excessive shipping fees. Before you get your undies in a bunch again please know that statement is not an accusation or in any way directed at you specifically here or at any time in the past it just is what it is.

I hope you get $300 for it, I really really do. Trying to predict ebay prices (or any free market activity for that matter) has had many folks scratch for a long time now.

Please don't give up on humankind just yet, Nathan. We could still surprise you. Smile

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Re: What's Wrong With Westone Guitar Prices?

Post by Westbone on Fri Apr 12, 2013 5:55 pm

"It's almost enough to make me lose my faith in humanity"

Especially if it's Korean....................... Smile


Last edited by Westbone on Fri Apr 12, 2013 5:57 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Re: What's Wrong With Westone Guitar Prices?

Post by Brainfertilizer on Fri Apr 12, 2013 5:56 pm

I'm not hoping for $300, I'm hoping for $200.

Panties aren't wadded, even though it might have sounded like it.

I've purchased guitars with $100 shipping costs. It didn't bother me that he "pocketed" $60 or so in shipping costs he didn't spend.

I just think it is silly for buyers to get their panties in a wad about shipping costs.

Let's say I put a $30 shipping cost on a guitar, and they win the bid. Then I refuse to send the guitar until they send me another $20 to cover PayPal and eBay listing costs. What do you think their reaction would be?

"No, that's covered in the cost of the bid."

Well, so is the shipping.

I've been a buyer and a seller. I understand the "total final price" concept from both ends, and I don't understand why others get pissy about it.

The next person who asks me to reduce shipping is going to get a huge surprise when I stick them with the charge for my scotch tape, marker ink, tire wear, oil use, and health care costs and owe me an additional $100 for shipping than they expect.

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Re: What's Wrong With Westone Guitar Prices?

Post by Westbone on Fri Apr 12, 2013 5:58 pm

Stop Bitchin'.............. Whipped

The one you sent me was not exactly"wrapped"

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Re: What's Wrong With Westone Guitar Prices?

Post by drsyn67 on Fri Apr 12, 2013 9:06 pm

~ gotta throw in my two Indian-head pennies. Recently traded with Nathan and not only was the box overly reinforced, he thought to wrap the instrument in bubblewrap INSIDE the OHSC (in addition to remembering to loosen the strings - which alot of idjuts (Bugs Bunny reference) forget to do.

Like him, I've been a buyer and a seller. Not anywhere near Steve's 120+ (so NOW we know how many you have - sorta Smile - but that said, I've had an attitude when I've seen the shipping be more than I was willing to spend AND I've also understood the cost involved with shipping (and considerations you mention). Sometimes a larger shipping charge has immediately turned me off, other times I understood. I think as a seller, you (we!) have to eat some of the cost to make the deal work. For the trade I sent to Nathan, I used USPS and their online Postage Price Calculator and the total cost was about $27 shipping Standard Post (which is in the last tab at the bottom called "Other Options")

(Sidenote: I found a reinforced box from an upholstery company that had an autoglass windshield shipped in it and it fit the teardrop case like a glove!)

Granted, it took longer to arrive (one day more than his UPS shipment to me for the trade), but I think it came out okay on his / your end. Pardon my use of flipping pronouns here, Nathan... I'm trying not to sound preachy to you and not of "higher authority" to anyone else reading the thread. I don't blame you for being ticked about your guitar not selling... I've lusted after it (if that makes you feel better)

As far as the bitchin'... I kinda don't blame him: Crap, its a Westone... almost all of them are overpriced now and to have one that isn't being fought over by (us) wlld dogs is disappointing. I think Mike nailed it with his two words (cents). Damn this economy... and this gov't. I just came from the tax office, so forgive me if I rant for a moment: I was blessed to have some amazing months last year, but now I'm paying for it... in a big way. Sad thing is... I was making crazee money last year and getting paid weekly... and the only guitar I bought during that whole time was a black Spectrum for $30 or $40. Head Bang I could have purchased that $795 Thunder that's been on Ebay for over a year and never noticed the money leaving my bank account. In hindsight, I don't know where the hell my brain was (exhausted, I guess). Thanks for listening to my weepin, bitching and moanin Razz

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Re: What's Wrong With Westone Guitar Prices?

Post by Brainfertilizer on Fri Apr 12, 2013 9:10 pm

translation of Drsyn67:
"This is supposed to be a happy occasion. Let's not bicker and argue about who killed who!"

(Sometimes my wry/tongue-in-cheek/laughing at myself tone doesn't come through in writing)

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Re: What's Wrong With Westone Guitar Prices?

Post by Brainfertilizer on Fri Apr 12, 2013 9:11 pm

One thing has occurred to me in the last 5 minutes:

I have gotten to the point where I value a guitar for its rarity, uniqueness, and potential, and so bumps/bruises don't even register for me anymore.

But that certainly isn't true for everyone.

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Re: What's Wrong With Westone Guitar Prices?

Post by Westbone on Fri Apr 12, 2013 9:46 pm

Talking about decent Jap.W 'tones or crap Korean one's?
They are just NOT the same QUALITY!


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Re: What's Wrong With Westone Guitar Prices?

Post by Iceman on Fri Apr 12, 2013 9:54 pm

Last thought on this subject and I'm out. Think of it this way...

I'm an interested party and watching your auction. I live relatively nearby in Philly, or Boston or PalookaVille, West Virginia... wherever. Your minimum bid alone right now to get things started is only twice what your want to ship it... and I am only one or two state lines away. But if I lived out in the lovely Bay Area next to my good neighbor Mike who has sold me on how great Westones are I pay the same charge to have it sent out.

And if I am just across a state line and cannot arrange to meet you to pick it up I (myself personally now) would wonder why it would only cost me another double-sawbuck extra to have it sent to me if I lived in Alaska or Hawaii??

To me it makes little sense... but that's just me.

Peace out. Very Happy

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Re: What's Wrong With Westone Guitar Prices?

Post by Westbone on Fri Apr 12, 2013 9:58 pm

?

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Re: What's Wrong With Westone Guitar Prices?

Post by drsyn67 on Fri Apr 12, 2013 10:03 pm

Ring the bell... that made me laugh out loud.

[quote="Brainfertilizer"]translation of Drsyn67:
"This is supposed to be a happy occasion. Let's not bicker and argue about who killed who!"

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Re: What's Wrong With Westone Guitar Prices?

Post by Guest on Fri Apr 12, 2013 11:06 pm

Just my opinion - when I buy a guitar off ebay, I expect and understand a 50 dollar shipping cost. Only when it is higher do I start to not wan tto buy it. I bid on a guitar the other day without looking at the shipping first, and then saw shipping was 150. And that was in the US! I immediatley retracted my bid, and as it stands now someone has bid higher. IMO it is was to high. 50 is fair IMO

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Re: What's Wrong With Westone Guitar Prices?

Post by corsair on Sat Apr 13, 2013 12:43 am

You fellas think its bad in the US/UK..... Try buying in Australia/NZ from anywhere else and see how you go!

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Re: What's Wrong With Westone Guitar Prices?

Post by Westbone on Sat Apr 13, 2013 10:33 am

Tell me all about it!
Here in the UK, £28 handling charge via customs, plus 20% VAT on the value.
That does not include postal charges as well!


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Re: What's Wrong With Westone Guitar Prices?

Post by Iceman on Sat Apr 13, 2013 10:51 am

VAT is an inevitability that will wear down time soon enough over here, Damian.

The 2 things the polis everywhere cherish above all else is {A} knowing what it best for we of the hoi polloi and {B} going about the business of devising the means by which they will bleed us to fund the former... Evil or Very Mad

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Re: What's Wrong With Westone Guitar Prices?

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