Repairing lock nuts !

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Re: Repairing lock nuts !

Post by corsair on Thu Apr 02, 2009 5:56 am

Yep, that's no worries, mate just PM me your postal addy and I'll flick it your way. Now, strictly speaking these aren't locking nuts; they are, in fact, a 'behind- the-nut' string lock and bear in mind that it is an original off one of my BD equipped guitars which has the E/A locking bolt thread stripped. I have on one occasion drilled and tapped the hole out to a 5mm and that worked a treat; didn't look very flash but functioned perfectly. Steve777 has another of my old stripped ones and has a plan so i would suggest getting in touch with him and finding out exactly what he's up to! You'll also need to get the locking washers and 4mm lockbolts for it from Spares - keeping in mind that on the E/A lock the bolt really could do with being about 2mm longer - tip courtesy of Steve777! - , and be aware that you will need 1mm washer-shaped shims underneath the strings when you lock it down... (otherwise you tend to break strings!!) I made mine out of the metal strapping you find on triple dump wool bales; a very sharp 4.5mm drill bit - which you'll need to resharpen after every hole! - and a very sharp file and you're away!
Yeah, Trevor I had the foresight to grab 3 or 4 complete baseplate assemblies when Spares made a small run of them so i'm more than happy to spread the good news, as it were! if someone can make something out of gear I should have by rights have thrown away, then I'm well pleased!

When they're set-up right, the Bendmaster Deluxe is capable of staying in tune for months with only small adjustments of the fine tuners necessary even with extreme use of the wang bar; I like it a lot - 3 of my guitars have them so I have to!

Now, we need someone to take pix of a Spectrum nut, and measure it so that either you or a luthier can make one; I've found the Spectrum/Phoenix nuts to be very good indeed and are made of graphite, I think but the spare one I made, I had made out of Micarta but with the measurements, you can just go to Stewmac or similar outfits online and order the one you want from their catalogues. From memory, I think a strat nut does the job, but I can't be sure now...

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FWIW, an after market esoteric nut is a solution to a problem that doesn't exist, and a great way to convert your money into someone else’s.

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Re: Repairing lock nuts !

Post by Trevor on Thu Apr 02, 2009 7:41 am

Thanks heaps for that Corsair i'll shoot you a PM.
Has anyone tried Helicoils to repair the thread?
Cheers.

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Re: Repairing lock nuts !

Post by Steve777 on Fri Apr 03, 2009 11:43 am

Hi Trevor,

Johns right, I have been repairing a BD string lock plate with TWO !!! stripped threads. And again, the man from Hobbit land supplied the offending item to repair !

What I needed was an original to work from. Once it arrived, I had a chat with some engineering friends and chuffed about having a couple milled out of stainless steel bar as a trial. Brass was also discussed. It all seemed get left in the air so I got on with the job of repairing the old one.

I didnt go down the helicoil road, but rather opted for hardened steel inserts with a thread on the outside and and M4 thread down the centre as original. As per the instructions, I drilled out the hole to 6mm and with the insert on a long M4 bolt and a nut behind it, wound it into the hole. It self cuts a thread as it goes down. The inserts are 2mm two long, so armed with my Dremel, I carefully ground off the excess.

However, I was told that there would be no need for Locktite, but they still turn somewhat. So I have emailed Locktite for recommendationon which of their products to permanently "lock" the inserts in. Still waiting although a friend has suggested using Superglue.

They look good, and considering it repairs an original, great. Now the shims!

I'm convinced that if the baseplate had been made from a harder material, such as SS, then 1mm bottom shim could of been dispensed with. Still, cest la vie.

The inserts come from a company called Tappex near Stratford upon Avon and maybe made in Gernany. The downside is that although they provided me with a couple of samples FOC, their minimum charge is £30 and that buys you about 30 ! So unless you planning to go into the repair business .... ho hum. There could be other companies doing the same. Have a look on their website.

The next thing to do as John has mentioned is the original design vis a vis bolt length is wrong. Because the all the stings are different thicknesses and the bolts are all the same length, the E/A hole always strips out because not enough threads are picked up. What I will do is set up the locknut with the clamps and bolts and off cuts of strings and then measure how long each bolt should be to just reach the bottom of the hole. That way, all the threads will be picked up and not just the top two.

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Re: Repairing lock nuts !

Post by corsair on Fri Apr 03, 2009 4:07 pm

So, you're saying this repair is a go-er, then!! Yay!! You beauty, well done! Milling them out of a billet would cost a bloody fortune, but this would appear to be a way forward!

I agree with the sentiment that if they'd had bolts of the right length, stripping wouldn't have been a problem! Whaddya reckon the OEM base is made from? I wonder if superglue is a good idea; the cheap ones probably aren't but I use Loctite 454 gel superglue generally and it's brilliant stuff if a little expensive; your bog standard thread thread locker is probably a much better bet, eh!

Are you gonna show us this repair.... Very Happy

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FWIW, an after market esoteric nut is a solution to a problem that doesn't exist, and a great way to convert your money into someone else’s.

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Re: Repairing lock nuts !

Post by Steve777 on Fri Apr 03, 2009 4:24 pm

Yup, no problem ! If locktite does its job, then good stuff ! As for the material the lock nut is made from, at first I thought is was brass but realised this was a coating under the black finish. Pretty sure its aluminium.

Not at home at present, so I'll post some pics as soon as I have 5 minutes .. ( OK Polly?)

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Re: Repairing lock nuts !

Post by corsair on Fri Apr 03, 2009 4:27 pm

Laughing

...yeah, I thought alloy as well but maybe a touch heavy..? I know when I touched a grinder to it there were no sparks! Although maybe in Hobbit-land that's normal....

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FWIW, an after market esoteric nut is a solution to a problem that doesn't exist, and a great way to convert your money into someone else’s.

corsair
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Re: Repairing lock nuts !

Post by corsair on Fri Apr 03, 2009 11:45 pm

Yep; I think you're right, lass; pick the tech stuff out and whack it into the Tech section, but leave the thread as it is still live what with Trevor's guitar still undergoing restoration/repair, and bear in mind that Steve has still to add a pic or two and post results of this new technique. Actually, Steve, there's a wee job for you, man - do a step by step guide to this procedure for morons like me!! Very Happy

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FWIW, an after market esoteric nut is a solution to a problem that doesn't exist, and a great way to convert your money into someone else’s.

corsair
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Re: Repairing lock nuts !

Post by Trevor on Fri Apr 03, 2009 11:57 pm

No problem here Pollyanna.
Thanks for all the helpfull info folks, its very much appreciated.
Cheers.

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Repairing lock nuts !

Post by Steve777 on Wed Apr 08, 2009 4:13 am

Hi John,

Thought I would start a specific thread just for this topic.

I havent got any further due to ... well errrr ... on going problems with the ex wife! Nuff said !

However, I am expecting a package containing Loctite 270 and the activator. Bought this off ebay as ex military surplus for the bargain price of £4.50 ish inc postage. Very pleased. I have taken some shots of the offending piece plus the inserts.

Give me a couple of days or so and I'll have the entire story !

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Re: Repairing lock nuts !

Post by halo71 on Wed Apr 08, 2009 6:29 am

You are having to use loctite to keep the nut tight? Wow, never heard that before. Maybe I am missing the rest of the story on your issue here?

halo71
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Re: Repairing lock nuts !

Post by Guest on Wed Apr 08, 2009 9:35 am

Hi Guys, Smile

Sorry for the confusion here chaps
Rolling Eyes but I have
merged the remainder of a discussion which was being carried out in the
Members Westones forums with this one because it seemed more
appropriate to put all of this technical and very helpful advice into one bundle in
this forum.
The lead up to this information can be found under the title of: My Spectrum SX from Down Under.

I hope this clears things up, and now Steve and John can continue giving helpful advice and tips, to their little hearts' content!
lol!

Pauline
:flower: :queen:

Guest
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Re: Repairing lock nuts !

Post by Steve777 on Wed Apr 08, 2009 12:23 pm

Hi Halo,

No, not the lock nut. If you read the the thread above, I have drilled out the the holes that had stripped their threads to 6mm and wound in hardened steel inserts that take an M4 bolt. The loctite is to keep the inserts secure and stop them winding themselves out over time.

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Re: Repairing lock nuts !

Post by halo71 on Sun Apr 12, 2009 8:49 pm

Ohhhhh, gotcha Steve! Smile

halo71
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Re: Repairing lock nuts !

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